Heroes Episode 4×08 Shadowboxing Spoilers

And I must confess that I’ve been hoping for Peter to meet mr. Gray too. Perhaps it would be appropriate to make it happen when/if the dust settles down with Sylar and Samuel.

Seriously, if S5 villain is Alice I think I’m going to shoot myself.

So uhm, where are you Matej? Site hasn’t been updated for ages.

you have a point gotchay, i mean karin left, sk’s really dialled it down and he was pissed about the site problems…if you look back at the above comments it lks like its mainly just u, f.d and myself now…

“Your comment is awaiting moderation” … wtf ?!?!
-k-

On another note, am I the only one to wonder if the locker/hanger Nathan’s coffin was in was the same one that we saw in season3? You know, the one Matt’s extracted the location from HRG in the motel room. Was that at building 26?

They looked remarkably similar but I can’t remember the number on the door in season 3.

*hangar

The place where they found Nathan’s coffin.

Looked like it was the same place that Peter went to after Matt read the address from HRG’s head in volume 4.

OK. Wicked episode, although I thought Peter was being a bit TOO over-skeptical of the Nathan-situation. I mean… for one, the Haitian isn’t known to bullshit; two, Nathan’s corpse; three, Matt’s confession… then Nathan’s admission/ acceptance… and he still ends up saying “ok, let’s just say I do believe it…” I think Sythan should have TK’d him into that wall head-first IMO Saying that, it looks like neither of them know that Sylar is back in his body. Cue epic struggle… We all know Sylar is the ’surprise guest’ that’s gonna be at Thanksgiving. I’ll put money on that.

Good to see Mohinder back again and in a decent role (i.e. not getting knocked out or incarcerated/ incapacitated/ drugged, etc) again… Oh, hold on, wait… he was again LOL! Thanks to Hiro! The more I think about it, that is pure comic genius – I wonder if it was intentional?

I started to think, before reading comments and watching the ep, that Samuel might be the one that murdered his brother… It would be about the biggest ‘transgression’ he could make, and would definitely show him up as one big bullsh*tting hypocrite… all his talk about family, etc. So he’s just using Joseph’s death as an excuse to gather more Specials, when really he just wanted him out of the way so that he could do so. Cold analysis, but that’s the long and short of it… Samuel doesn’t seem to care about anyone but himself that much. Look at his manipulation of a sick a dying Hiro…

… Who, by the way, SMACKED IT with his rescue of Suresh! So his multiple saving of Tad-from-the-roof was kinda foreshadowing this event. And again, just coz it’s happened to Mo so many times, I think it’s hilarious the way Hiro kept him outta the way… He likes using ‘The Monroe Trick’, doesn’t he?

Question: Claire’s foot?

It had the same visual effects when he healed people at the train wreck. I guess Parkman got bruises from falling facedown on concrete or something, because I can’t see why/how Samuel would’ve interacted with him.

About Peter being skeptical… if you believe it’s extreme, take a look at next episodes sneek peak. Angela is in total, hysterical DENIAL. And she KNOWS it’s not really Nathan. Give Peter an episode to swallow the truth that his brother is dead and the guy that looks like him, acts like him, feels like him… is the one who killed him.

Above everything, Peter must be denying the fact that he didn’t see anything. He used to be extremely empathic. He should’ve figured something was wrong the moment “Nathan” called him and reached out for him at the hospital.

I’m eager to see how Sylar will be contained from killing everyone involved in his memory wipe. Let’s face it… they can’t seriously have him kill Matt, HRG, Peter (who incapacitated him) and Angela.

Will he somehow get convinced to do otherwise? Will “Nathan” help out in containing him?

I could, for example, picture “Nathan” telling Peter where the vulnerable spot is located while he’s still somewhat in control. Then maybe writers could make something up that since the spot got moved in a no-vital spot, it didn’t actually kill Sylar but it disabled his abilities (I’m certainly not the only one thinking Sylar is becoming due for a power reset again, right?)

Alternatively, “Nathan” could try to fly in orbit or something. Sylar can regenerate but he still needs to breath.

Just because writers said “Nathan” would need to say goodbye to Peter doesn’t mean Sylar is coming back. Perhaps both Quinto and Pasdar are done, and “Nathan” will make sure to shut Sylar down for good. That would be a pretty damn good redemption even though a lot of fans would miss Sylar.

@sk74 11.19.09 at 3:42 pm

I think you may be onto something. I know they said Samuel’s power manifies the more Specails he’s surrounded with and if Ando shows up, YIKES! Sylar might just be the one to take Samuel out, if he is motivated in that direction. The trouble is Samuel was actually nice to Sylar and tried to fix him, so if a whole mind and body Sylar recalls that fact, Sylar might just take Samuel’s side and then folks are really in trouble.

I think the reason Peter started looking at “Nathan” differently because when he touched his hand to take his flight ability, it must’ve felt the same when he took the morphing ability in the hotel room in the last ep of S3 and probably had to go through multiple abilities just to get his flight. That to me is when he seemed totally different and said he had the “feeling” he was Sylar…I think he knows he’s Sylar but Nathan is still trapped in there to a degree so he wants to know for sure. That and after Matt told him Sylar cut his throat and the body had stitches across that area clearly when he looked. Nathan’s body is in some good condition for a few months, eh?? LOL This is probably my only hope that he could be saved, but guess that won’t happen…oh well….

Agreed 100%… That look gave it away for real straight after the copy, and the “What are YOU doin’?… I’ll be right behind you…” sealed it for me.

Of course we’re all basing our theories around the fact that Pasdar is leaving the show.

I wouldn’t count on having Sylar as a savior with a newborn conscience out of Nathan’s memory. If anything, Sylar would want to stop Samuel in order to open his head and figure out his ability.

They would also have to reconnect Sylar and Samuel somehow. “Nathan” doesn’t remember anything from the Carnival, it was “Blank state Sylar” who went there. He probably doesn’t even know who Samuel is.

Oh, and Samuel wasn’t nice to Sylar. He wanted him for a specific reason, saying he could use him to defend the carnival. I believe Samuel has ambitions to go all-out against non-specials, and specials will have to choose a side: support him or fight him.

ok 2x snippets from tvguide about Thanksgiving:

http://spoilertv.iimmgg.com/image/398c59a926e5d2521d86c0ba561ec0ba

http://spoilertv.iimmgg.com/image/a2afbdc5425ca96b32b2436352bd0afc
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gah! only just watched last ep, have to say i was abit dissapointed by the hospital scene – mind you proberly my own fault by looking at the promo pic’s but i thought there would be alot more in it – although i’ve know cottoned on to what sylar was saying (i dont have time for you to go throught the five stages of grief) ah so i guess the eppy title is in honour of peter then, btw when is “the fifth stage” on?… oh that reminds me, i found a schedule for new eps that run until the second week of dec.
erm did anyone find the claire/tracy bit funny?, well actually i found it hilarious when tracy was trying to catch claire foot.
-k-

agreed kerry, i hoped for a longer hospital scene, nearly halfway through the season, my highlights:

- samuel has become a worthy villain.
- matt parkman and hiro are both back at there best…although hiro is still dying.
- claire is less boring but still has a long way to go
- sylar has been an incredible plot line
- they really have been taking care of the fine details this season ‘why was nathan’s absence not noticed’ was answered.
- we saw charlie again

criticisms:

- emma is still alive.
- despite all hopes peter is still half what he used to be…wasnt emma meant to come in and fix that????
-kjj/.,

@sk, yup, the “what are YOU doing” stood out to me as well and it was wierd almost like Pete is going just to keep an eye on him, but without his empathy, what can he really do?? Take TK from Sylar and open his head up for a minute maybe??

@ F.D.
‘@gotay and sk I believe Peter said as in “WTF are you thinking? No way, I’m not letting you down.” ‘

Yes, but I think he ALSO means ‘if you ARE Sylar, I’m gonna be right there behind you… on your case.” Maybe before he grabbed Nathan’s hand and took his ability he was on a ‘help my bro no matter what the cost’ vibe, but THE MOMENT he copied his ability he KNEW (but still didn’t want to believe or accept it… denial, first stage…). Watch that scene VERY carefully… straight after the copy, before Pete says what r U doin… watch his facial expression, his breathing (like he’s had a shocking realisation, or getting ready for fight/ flight… adrenaline starts to rush) and THE WAY HE LOOKS AT NATHAN. It’s like he knew by the touch that it is Sylar, but to his eyes it still looks like Nathan, acts like Nathan. CHECK OUT THOSE FEW SECONDS AGAIN!!! IMO, if Pete had just come face to face with the real Sylar, his reaction would have been verfy similar (change of breathing, not-gonna-let-you-outta-my-sight attitude, ready to fight, etc).

His attitude says to me “I’m behind you all the way Big Bro, won’t let you down no matter what”… at the same time it also screams “If that really IS you Sylar, you bastard, I’m right behind you and I won’t let up… I’m on ya ass like a fly on shit. Watch out!” Again, check the look… even just before they take off, Pete is looking at Sythan like “WTF? It CAN’T be…”

Classic case of ‘keep your friends close and your enemies closer’.

@F.D.
“Maybe, although I’m wondering if this is not acting over-analyzing. ”

It could well be, but I’ve watched the episode about 3 times now… every single time since the first time, that scene has stood out. If the circumstances were different (i.e. if Peter hadn’t been tipped off by Rene, hadn’t seen DeadNathan, and hadn’t heard Matt’s confession) and Peter had merely tried to copy Flight from Sythan and THEN acted in the same way (expression, rapid breathing, dialogue and the LONG SUSPICIOUS STARE that he gave him before they flew away) I would have twigged that Peter knows something. The behaviour and body-language JUMPED out of the screen at me and struck me as odd from the first viewing… LONG before I watched it again and ‘over-analysed’ the acting! And BTW, after analysing it, and deciding that it was intended, I think the acting was on point

C’mon F.D., since end of last season we have been speculating that if Peter tries to copy “Nathan’s” ability, it’s highly likely that he will AT LEAST sense that something isn’t right – or he’ll know straight away that it’s Sylar. I’m sure SOMEBODY wrote “I can’t wait to see the WTF look on Peter’s face when he tries to copy “Nathan’s” power…”, I’m not sure who wrote that, could have been gotay or alexx or someone… it could even have been YOU yourself, F.D.! And now we have that exact scenario occur, don’t tell me you missed it?!?

To drive my point home: the brothers both saw Nathan’s corpse… Peter shrugged his shoulders and said “must be a shapeshifter. He let Sythan walk out of that place as he pulled the shutters down and followed him. NO BIG DEAL. NO WORRIES.

Eventually they go to see Parkman… notice how Peter walks ahead of ‘Nathan’ (no reason to be wary of him… no need to watch his back). Matt confesses, spills his guts. Considering they have just seen the corpse with trauma around the throat area which backs up Matt’s story, Peter’s spidersense should have been tingling (OK, wrong Peter, but same thing really). Still, he doesn’t want to believe it, get’s angry with Parkman. But he DID try to usher ‘Nathan’ out of the room.

Mountain top: Peter seems a bit confused while ‘Nathan’ talks and paces around. When Nate is about to fly away, Pete grabs his hand and copies his power…. BAM! Attitude completely changes! Now he is focussed (and his sight is focussed right on ‘Nathan’). The way he talks to him from then on is completely ‘no-nonsense’. CHECK THE STARE! He says I’ll be RIGHT BEHIND YOU… This isn’t for reassurance. There is anger in his voice… it means “I’m not letting you go ANYWHERE on your own, are you crazy?” CHECK THE STARE!! Before they take off (notably ‘Nathan’ first, and as promised, Peter is RIGHT behind him… like he might not be able to trust him not to try to give him the slip), Peter is standing behind ‘Nathan’… STILL STARING AT HIM, even though it’s at the back of his head. THIS IS NOT THE LOOK OF SOMEONE WORRIED ABOUT HIS BROTHER… CHECK THE STARE!!! He sensed/ knew something was not right when he took the power, and as far as I’m concerned it’s plain to see in that scene right there.

Finally, if Pete saw his bro’s corpse and was still ok with Sythan, and then heard Matt’s confession and was still ok with Sythan, then what happened between then and the end of the ep to make him so stand-offish and wary of Sythan? Only the copying of his power. So IMO that STARE… sorry, that reaction… meant something, otherwise Peter wouldn’t have been standing across the room from his bro with his arms folded, giving him the look that Sythan remarked about… He wouldn’t go from brother’s keeper to brother’s starer for no reason… so he must trust his own senses (coz he denied everything else) which means he got some info from the touch… and he would have reacted. CHECK THE STARE!!!!

You guys could be right. I just think leaving it to acting isn’t necessarily a good idea. I have the feeling that Peter will mention it at the Thanksgiving diner.

Right now, Peter knows the guy next to him is NOT Nathan. But he still doesn’t want to believe that the body in the coffin is his brother’s.

It’s only a shame that Peter didn’t even TRY to heal/revive the body before taking off. Didn’t he watch pushing daisies? That would’ve been quite a wink at Brian Fuller.

sk74 11.20.09 at 3:10 pm

I think I might have said something along the lines of “OK what’s gonna happen when Peter touches ‘Nathan’ and tries to copy ‘Nathan’s’ fight?”

@F.D. 11.20.09 at 3:36 pm
Interesting idea about having Peter try to revive the Nathan in the Coffin but Peter may not have tried because he had no way of knowing how long that person was dead. It might not have worked.

But seriously, imagine the plot twist. Writers giving false leaks about Pasdar being written out and then having Peter miraculously revive him for yet another “Nathan never dies”. It would’ve been hilarious.

@ Tarot
So please tell me you noticed the STARE? (jk – I’ve already made a big enuf deal out of it already!)

@F.D.
“You guys could be right. I just think leaving it to acting isn’t necessarily a good idea.”

I know what ur saying, bro… I just think it was WAYYYY TOO blatant to not be significant.
I didn’t notice that Pete was standing by an open window tho (or I probably would’ve used that to back up my point too )… I wonder if it was so that Sythan couldn’t leave, or if it was so that he could make a quick escape if he had to? Either way, he’s not taking any chances.

So, we knew it was gonna happen… how long before Peter remember’s his “have you ever lost a brother” talk with Samuel and inevitably goes to the Carnival? I don’t think he’s gonna want to visit Mom anytime soon (well, not after Thanksgiving).

peter has seen so much evidence that now thanksgiving is all about confirmation. but its not just nylar now, its both of them. at least while sylar was in matt, nylar could be anyone he wantd to be, but thats all different now.

i agree, why do we need to watch the bennets at dinner…seriously there is no point to it, i feel like heroes is ruining itself with what could be refered to as ‘liabilities’.